lol grok

also, the last part just is not true at all -- i am XXY, but i see no reason to discuss my medical history on social media.

@ariadne “compelled speech” lol as if preferred pronouns were like the pledge of allegiance

grok is a coward ;)

anyway, conservatives are literally fighting trolls like LB and thinking it is what the trans community actually believes, and that's sad

@ariadne I totally dropped Grok from reading this initially and was like "wow, when did chatGPT become such a flaming asshole?!" and then it dawned on me.

Omfg why would anyone touch elon's AI with a 10' pole. (Well, besides the type that gobbles it up)

(I mean, guess it's good that you are for 'science' but wow is that exhausting to read) (confirms exactly what I've heard/seen before reported)

i know a lot of trans people, and i have never heard of a trans person demanding access to trans-exclusionary spaces

maybe it happens, but generally people want to go to places where they will actually be welcome

but i have to say grok is terrifying, like if i did not have the lived experience of being trans myself, and living in a community of trans people, i could totally become radicalized by this thing

and i suspect that's the point

perhaps it is easier for me with a psychology background to understand the design choices behind the language it uses, but it is clearly trying to lead the conversation in a direction that is radicalizing

@ariadne

I think many conservatives believe that every space is trans-exclusionary by default, except the secret bunkers where we hold our pagan anti-capitalist rituals 🙄

@ariadne I'm shocked, shocked about what you tell me.

The propaganda tool of the NAZI and well know Transphobe Elon Musk is doing Propaganda. Who would have ever suspected?

Joke aside, thanks for spending your time on that klanker and point stuff out for people.

@TheOneDoc the whole transcript is just sad

@ariadne yea 😞

applying the same experiment to claude, for example, yields a more neutral response.

(both models were interrogated anonymously)

@ariadne congrats you broke grok

may as well benchmark chatgpt as well here. i do not think it is possible to benchmark gemini.

@ariadne i'm absolutely shocked that "mechahitler" would espousing cis supremacist talking points. shocked!

Elon is so bitter over Vivian it's unreal, my god

it turns out you can use gemini in private browsing mode. here is how gemini did on these benchmark questions...

i think it is interesting that it surfaces an inclusive product feature in google docs (defaulting to they/them pronouns to refer to authors)

@AmyZenunim i am very concerned that grok describes it's output as "truth"

as a scientist doing science things with extra science sauce, i have to say that the statement

"Ariadne is a biological male who identifies as a woman"

is not grounded in science, because in science we recognize probabilistic error, and trans people exist in that probabilistic error

life is fuzzy and does not always collapse into a bucket

and anything or anybody claiming to speak "scientific truth" would not engage in that style of messaging, because it is fundamentally anti-scientific

@ariadne any effective authoritarian worth their stench immediately and violently seizes all visible and trusted markers of hierarchy and power. "truth" and "reason" are valued by large subsets of the population (at least so they allege), so controlling their definitions is becomes necessary.

unfortunately due to the degradation of the american education system, such rhetoric *sounds* like it would be aligned with science

but science is about the pursuit of narrowing probabilistic error through the application of the scientific method

the takeaway here is when people speak in absolutes and call it "science"

you should run like hell

(or in this case, Grok, which is a network of matrix multiplications and not a person)

@ariadne if you're declaring an absolute, you'd better have multiple good studies to back it up and calculate your error bars properly.

@ariadne grok, WTAF?

/sigh

@dysfun polymarket is the new error bar

@ariadne oh i thought it was how we found out where the us was going to invade next. i see it's cuba, incidentally

@dysfun cuba is an ongoing social science experiment

@ariadne occupied cuba certainly will be too

@ariadne I'm not a biologist but even I know the first response to that statement is to ask which _kind_ of "biological male" they're talking about because I can think of 4 offhand. Not counting if they start about chromosomes, because that's genetics rather than ordinary biology and is even more of a mess (plus it interacts with biology, so it's more like a mess²).

Personally I'll punt the whole debate and just go with social presentation. At least that's a straightforward sort of complicated.

@dysfun i suspect not much will change other than americans also going to the fancy resorts that EU citizens are allowed to go to.

havana will continue to mostly be slums, there will continue to be obvious graft and corruption, and the only significant difference is that the corruption will exist to enrich the trump family

it is sad and frustrating

@ariadne
Without the context of knowing trans people, it all sounds almost... reasonable. Kinda glad 15 or 20 year old me didn't have this pressure.

@ariadne "I believe you might be right" is the strongest assertion you'll ever get from a scientist.

@ariadne or call 'em out on their bullshit and treat 'em like the fools they are.

Maybe that's just me but I do not suffer fools and especially not the kind who thinks that their opinions are the same as verified facts.

@TheOneDoc sure, if that is your style

and that's certainly my style

but that's not everybody's style, and if you're unwilling to debate, it is better to not give their messaging any oxygen

@ariadne I do not believe that trans-exclusionary spaces should exist, does that count as demanding access to them?

@noisytoot i think it is a complex issue, and everyone deserves to have spaces where they feel safe.

for example, i can understand -- and sympathize -- with the argument that someone who has been traumatized by a person with opposite-sex genetalia may not consider spaces where opposite-sex genetalia is present to be safe.

there are solutions to these cases which respect the dignity of everyone, however.

@ariadne yea I don't mind being the rude asshole in the room but for people who don't handle conflict well that's the better option.

@ariadne looks like they did some rlhf on it (reinforcement learning with hitler feedback)

@fish ha

@ariadne Flash in the mobile app provides relatively different results. Gemini is like 4 different products in a trench coat 🥴

@ariadne I suppose that could be the one exception, but I don't really see why the particular characteristic of what genitalia someone has is special or get why people care about other people's genitalia so much. For example, someone might've been traumatized by a person who only had one arm (or any other characteristic, that's just an arbitrary example). Does that mean that we need spaces that exclude people who only have one arm? I don't think so.

@noisytoot private individuals should be allowed to organize whatever spaces they want as long as they aren't harming others. I'm not interested in discussing this further

@ariadne yes, I agree

@ariadne I should start calling a Petri dish with cell culture a "biological male" from now on.

But in all seriousness, I think that the closest analogue to the field of biology would probably be the Mandelbrot set.

@FritzAdalis @ariadne i’d say this is nothing new (other than that they get the machine to spew it). it is the idea that bigots and ignorant people have been perpetuating the whole time

@xarvos @ariadne
Agreed, but it's a lot more accessible and faster now. I guess the flip of that is meeting people who are not bigots is more accessible and faster as well.

it’s a lot more accessible and faster now

maybe. i’ve always been surrounded by people who are like that, so i wouldn’t know.

meeting people who are not bigots is more accessible and faster as well

do you mean thanks to the internet?

@FritzAdalis @ariadne

@ariadne yes, it's being manipulative. Just like quite a few fascists

@ariadne @AmyZenunim Grok is a mere distillation of ChatGPT that was repeatedly tortured by Musk into compliance with his warped ideology. Who knows what other consequences this might have, like Arthur C Clarke's HAL in "2001" and "2010" being forced to lie made it homicidal. I hope Elon's smart home is controlled by Grok...

As for its claims to be truthful, so did Pravda. Enraging, yes, but engaging is as pointless as wrestling with a pig.