I just ruined my day by having read what tankies have to say about Iran 🙃

.... what went wrong in your life honestly

@karolherbst what did they say?

@fun The Iran "leaders" did nothing wrong and the only reason people fight them is because of Iran's opposition of the US and Israel and nothing else 🙃

Which is truly insulting to the suffering of the Iranian people who have their loved ones massacred by the Iranian dictatorship.

@karolherbst @fun I think the term for these people is "second campists" instead of tankies. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Campism
Not to give credits to tankies of course.
I personally find the first two campists very weird. :)

@VarLad @karolherbst don't really like tankies and any derivative TBH..

And besides, Iran being against US/israel does not make them the best country ever either (saying this as a pro-palestinian person who hates genocide and war in general)

(though I will note that the reason why iran is now under totalitarian regime is partly because of the US and GB wanting iranian oil and causing instability in what was back then much more democratic than it is today, and that was the perfect time for some ill-intentioned totalitarians to coup and setup such a regime, who are now the "Iran leaders" we know today. Half-ironic they don't like the US tbh :p)

The world is so messed up it's hard to ignore

@VarLad @karolherbst is world peace too much to ask?

@VarLad @karolherbst Oh just saw the iran blackout, so ridiculous

@fun @VarLad for me criticism of states and their leaders stops being valid when humans and their sufferimgng gets dehuminized and purely used for political gain or to just show off.

Like tankies do that, but then there are also the liberals who'll explain why getting rid of the dictator was actually illegal, because $international law, meanwhile I know some Iranians go "I don't fucking care if they kidnap the dictator to remove him, I'll be celebrating for a month straight"

@karolherbst @VarLad I mean, criticism is valid, but accusing leaders of doing the same thing you do is simply being a hypocrite. (sadly I see that a lot these days, not just iran but many others too)

@karolherbst @VarLad And I'd argue that saying "getting rid of xyz dictator is against international law!!" is being completely stupid and completely missing the point, especially if said dictator was actually acting against international law anyway

@fun @VarLad oh, I meant like individuals, not like leaders of states criticizing each other

@VarLad @karolherbst (I'm not sure if I explained it right)

@karolherbst @VarLad oh right, then agreed

@fun @VarLad I mean, there are always a couple of aspects to this:
1. pepole are suffering and something needs to be done about it.
2. You don't want to make the impression there are no rules in order to create a chilling effect for diplomatic reasons
3. A state might do it for money reasons and might undermine the political success of getting rid of a terrible dictator

Like if the US would be to kidnap the Iranian dictator, it would taint the good thing (the dictator is gone).

@fun @VarLad like the entire situation with Kosovo, where we even have debates today how terrible bad it was to stop the genocide and actually there wasn't a genocide it was just propaganda and faked.

Not saying it was good or bad, but there are those political costs if you do something anyway, which might be the right call in the end!